Art, Science, and the Sea: Jeanne Walker Harvey On Else Bostelmann’s Extraordinary Life

A podcast interview with Jeanne Walker Harvey on The Growing Readers Podcast, a production of The Children’s Book Review.

Have you ever heard of Else Bostelmann, the courageous artist who painted the marvels of the deep sea in the 1930s? If not, you’re in for a treat!

In the latest episode of The Growing Readers Podcast, Jeanne Walker Harvey, the author of Else B. In the Sea: The Woman Who Painted the Wonders of the Deep, explores the fascinating story of this pioneering female artist whose work sparked wonder and advanced marine science. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in art, science, conservation, and the power of pursuing your dreams. It offers valuable lessons about creativity, perseverance, and the importance of uncovering and sharing the stories of unsung trailblazers and role models.

Harvey’s new picture book biography, Else B. In the Sea, delves into Bostelmann’s groundbreaking work at the intersection of art and science. Bostelmann fearlessly descended into the ocean depths in a copper diving helmet to paint the magnificent marine life that scientist William Beebe was discovering on his expeditions. Her stunning artwork, published in National Geographic, brought the strange beauty of the deep sea to the public eye for the first time.

Jeanne Walker Harvey Talks About:

• Else Bostelmann’s remarkable life and work as an artist exploring the deep sea
• The challenges and joys of researching and writing about lesser-known historical figures
• Collaborating with illustrator Melodie Stacey to bring Bostelmann’s story to life
• The intersection of art and science in Bostelmann’s paintings of newly discovered marine life
• Bostelmann’s courage in diving into the ocean depths to pursue her art
• The impact of Bostelmann’s artwork in introducing the wonders of the deep to the wider world
• The importance of inspiring curiosity, creativity, and conservation in young readers
• Encouraging kids to follow their passions and make a difference, even in small ways
• Uncovering and sharing the stories of unsung trailblazers and role models

So, what are you waiting for? Dive into this fascinating conversation and discover the incredible story of Else Bostelmann, the woman who painted the wonders of the deep!

Listen to the Episode

Read the Transcript

Bianca Schulze

Well, hello, Jeanne. Welcome back to The Growing Readers Podcast. I am so happy to discuss your new picture book biography, which is Else B. In the Sea: The Woman Who Painted the Wonders of the Deep. But before we jump right into the book, or I should say dive right into the book and your writing, have you been up to anything exciting since we last spoke in person about Ablaze with Color, which, if you can believe, was back in 2022?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I know, that’s amazing. But first of all, Bianca, thank you so much for inviting me back to The Children’s Book Review. You are just such an amazing podcaster, reviewer, and supporter of kidlit in the extreme, so big, heartfelt, virtual hugs. It really makes such a difference in our world when we receive so much support from people like you. And I love your podcast.

Bianca Schulze

You just made me blush.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

So, Ablaze with Color. Actually, it’s pretty exciting because the Washington, DC Library Foundation has selected it for its spring featured book for all the libraries, and they’re buying so many copies to give out for free to patrons. And the idea of more children and families being able to read the book, especially in Washington, DC, where she painted, lived, and taught, is extremely exciting and such an honor.

Bianca Schulze

Wow. That is amazing. And I just love seeing Ablaze with Color‘s book cover popping up on social media all the time. It’s been a constant. It’s always been in the front. And I love that you always do such a good job of working with people behind the scenes to create such amazing resources to pair with the book. I mean, the educator’s guide and the activity kit for that book were so phenomenal. So I just love that people are really receiving that book, and it’s amazing that so many kids are going to receive that book for free.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

It’s thrilling. Yes. And thank you, Bianca. I love working as a team on the resources and the backup material because it does make a difference. As someone who has taught for a bit and as a parent, I know that when you have extra material to share and learn from the book, it makes such a difference. So it’s really great.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. Well, I just have to ask this question because I feel like I did ask you this in 2022, but is there anything fun that you do in your day-to-day practices just to kind of get you warmed up and ready for writing?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

So my cat and I dance around a lot because I just love it. I think with a dance class, I find that I have to concentrate so much on the moves so that I don’t fall over, and then I can’t think about anything else. Whereas it’s great to go for a walk or a hike, and I do that often, too. But then I start thinking about things. This is a way that I totally can’t think about anything else. And then I feel like I have a fresh start when I look at the words again.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. That’s amazing. Is it a specific style of dance, or do you like a variety?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I love Zumba. So, obviously, it’s not to be shared in public, but I just think it’s really fun. And the teachers are always so positive. So it’s, you know, salsa and just spicing it up. I love it.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, I feel like it’s all coming back to me. I feel like we absolutely talked about that last time, and it is for the public. Don’t be afraid to share those moves, Jeanne.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Maybe in a big group, in a dark club.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There you go. All right, well, talk to me about your cat. What’s your cat’s name?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Her name is Allie, because I lived in Sausalito by San Francisco on an alley. So she’s my alley cat that I adopted when she was just one year old. She is definitely my writing companion and lets me know when I’ve been sitting too long. She will paw my face because she likes to go outside. You know, pet pals are great.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. And I actually didn’t know. I knew you were in the San Francisco area, but we must have almost been neighbors at some point because I used to live in San Anselmo in the Marin County area, and I loved wandering down the streets of Sausalito.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Great.

Bianca Schulze

All right, well, let’s dive into the book. So, I love that you focused on a woman that many people will not have heard of despite her incredible contributions to some really major scientific discoveries. Can you start by telling us a bit about Else Bostelmann and why you were drawn to share her story?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I read an article, and I’m always just diving deep into as many resources as I can to find these interesting, inspiring people that we should know about. Particularly, I like creative people. And this story really drew me in because it’s a classic STEAM story with the science, as you mentioned, plus the art.

Else was born in 1882 in Germany, and when she came to the US, she married an American. Her husband decided he wanted to be a farmer in Texas, so they went there for a couple of years. Tragically, he died, probably from over-exertion and not knowing how to be a farmer. But she had a young child, so when she went back to New York, she had to find jobs using her talent as a fine artist, which she had studied and won awards for in Germany. But she really wanted to do nature painting. That was her passion from the get-go.

And when she heard about William Beebe’s expeditions, he was going all over the world, but at this point, he was headed to Bermuda in the 1930s to explore off the coast of Bermuda. And she apparently walked in with her drawings and paintings, and maybe this is… I didn’t put it in the book because it’s not confirmed, but there were a couple of people that said she just walked in and said, “I really want this job.” And she was almost 50 years old. Think about that time in the 1930s. How many women were doing something like that and said, “I want to be your expeditions artist”? So it was quite a bold, adventuresome thing. I think she seems like she was kind of a rock star in that world.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. And so, I love that when we’re writers, there’s always a piece of us, at least in fiction, somewhat hidden in the characters or the intention behind the story. So I wonder what it is about yourself, and I don’t know if you’ve stopped to think about this, that you felt really driven or connected to Else. What part of you was it that wanted to tell her story?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

What a great question, and I really haven’t thought about it, but now thinking about it, it really resonates that she, at 50, would go on such an adventure. I just went with my family, my sons, their girlfriends, my partner, to Costa Rica for the first time last month, and that was an adventure for me because I tend not to do crazy things. But we went on an insane white water rafting trip, and that was the best burrito I’ve ever eaten afterward because I lived.

And I think the idea that Else Bostelmann was willing to don a copper helmet before scuba diving was invented and go off the boat into the water so that she could experience it herself, and then repeatedly go down there and paint with just this tube of air up to the boat, was really amazing for this woman, who was not someone who was an adventurer at all. So that’s a really fun question. I had not thought of that.

Bianca Schulze

All right, well, it kind of leads into my next question, which is one of the things that really stood out to me was Else’s bravery and that pioneering spirit in donning that clunky hat in the 1930s, as you said. I mean, that’s incredible, to paint these beautiful wonders of the deep sea that she was discovering. So what did you hope to convey about Else’s character and her achievements through the book?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I really hope that children will pursue their passions and interests, even though there will be challenges and setbacks. And they will be afraid because we all have been afraid of doing something new or scary or something that others say, “You can’t do that. That’s never been done,” or “You shouldn’t do that.”

And also the idea that one person can make such a difference in these major discoveries that we hear about the main person, such as William Beebe, who was the scientist that led these expeditions, but without Else Bostelmann’s paintings, which were published in National Geographic, for the whole world to get to experience the deep, dark, bioluminescent creatures and a whole strange new world like space was to us in the sixties and still is now, she made such a difference. I want children to realize any person can make a difference behind the scenes. So, everyone’s contributions are important in any way.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. Well, as you said, the book highlights how Else’s artwork helped bring attention to the groundbreaking deep-sea expeditions led by scientist William Beebe. So, can you share more about the intersection of art and science in Else’s work?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Yes. So she was, as I said, a fine artist. She could paint such beautiful, detailed paintings, which were very important because she and William Beebe wanted to portray these incredible deep-sea fish, many of which had never been seen before, and this was before photography. So the science part of it is she would get out a microscope and carefully look at each fish that had been trawled from the depths of the ocean.

But also he would describe in detail what he had seen. So they would work in conjunction. She’d be able to try to convey every little fin and where every part of the fish existed underwater, which wasn’t easy because, by the time it comes up through the pressure of the ocean, they don’t look the same as they do in their beauty and magnificence underwater. In the back matter, we’ve included a section on the underwater color spectrum, because as she went underwater to paint herself, she noticed certain colors faded, such as red in her red bathing suit.

We also talk about bioluminescence, that science which is so fascinating to me, and the chemical reactions involved. I hope children will read that section and say, “Oh, I want to learn more about that.” I had seen bioluminescence for the first time when I was sailing with a friend up in Puget Sound back in high school, and we had seen the magic shimmering behind the boat. That memory just stands with me. So it’s very exciting, the idea that this book combines art and science.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. And when you were describing how she would look at the fish under the microscope, I immediately just thought of the illustrations because there is a great illustration of Else literally creating art as she’s looking at a fish under the microscope. So, let’s talk a little bit about the artwork. Or we can talk a lot about the artwork, too. It doesn’t have to be a little bit because the illustrations by Melodie Stacey in this book are so stunning, and they really do transport the reader into the underwater world that Else explored. So, talk to me about the way Melodie brings Else’s story to life and what her artwork means to you when you look at this book.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Just as you said, it is stunning. I mean, it’s just all the details and magnificent colors and the richness of the scenes that she paints. The fairyland aspect is way beyond what I could have even envisioned. And she is a fine artist, so she painted with, I’m going to get the exact words, she painted with gouache, watercolor, pastels, and colored pencils. So she was really using wonderful art materials, just as Else Bostelmann did also.

Melodie was so careful in her research also, which is so important to me. She even looked for what the tugboat looked like and she found a photo of that. And there’s a photo she found of what people would wear in different eras. You know, these details make such a difference. Because I care so much that our books are as accurate as possible because children are sponges, and this is what they’re absorbing, and I want them to absorb facts and actualities.

But, you know, the magic of illustrations in picture books, I feel just beyond lucky to get to write picture books because I love art and I love illustrations, and I can’t do it at all. It would be stick figures. So, her ability to paint these incredible illustrations is so appreciated.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, I love that. And so you and I know, and probably most of our listeners know, that the authors and illustrators of picture books don’t often meet or chat. And I love it when someone hears that for the first time, they’re like, “What? The author and the illustrator don’t chat?” But, you know, sometimes they do. So I was wondering if you know about any of the pressures that Melodie might have felt when she was creating the art because I imagine that when you’re creating free art, that’s very freeing. But when you’re creating art that is almost honoring another artist, I mean, that must be extra pressure. Did you hear anything about that?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I think you’re exactly right. What was interesting was that I did get… She lives in the UK, and I did send to her the two original National Geographic magazines in which Else’s paintings and William Beebe’s words were printed. And she wrote me the nicest email in the midst of the illustration process, which, as you said, we’re usually supposed to not communicate. But she said that she was pretty confident that her grandfather would have seen these exact National Geographics because he subscribed and always read all of them. And this would have been during his era. And that seemed really touching, too, that maybe that connection with another generation.

So, as far as accuracy, I sent her as many photos as I could because she said, “I want to paint this as accurately as possible.” And she did. I mean, she went above and beyond. So it was a little tricky with the color spectrum, as I said, because she had such vivid colors in the underwater magical scene. But we just… I discussed with my editor, who passed it on to the art director, who passed it on to her. As you said, we don’t talk directly, but we conveyed that the red suit of Else needed to be much more muted to represent how she was seeing the world underwater.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, that makes so much sense. And how did you find the National Geographics? Are they easy to track down?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Oh, I love finding anything. It’s like being a detective now. They weren’t that easy to track down, especially two copies, because I wanted one set for me and one set for her. And then to look at it, there’s lots of old ads, and you just get a flavor of that era. And compared to the other articles in those National Geographic editions, one realizes it must have been amazing to see Else Bostelmann’s beautiful paintings of these creepy, weird-looking fish. It would be as if someone said, “Well, we saw these Martians up in space when we went up there.” So it’s pretty magical. But I love digging for research. You know, it’s also another thing… I don’t have to write. I get to spend a lot of time looking for things. And sometimes that’s a nice break.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. Well, I have to ask: do you have a favorite illustration?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Oh, that’s such a good question. It’s so tough for me. I guess the… But the cover is amazing. Just, she’s in that fairyland, and actually sitting and painting, it’s just such a wild concept, and Melodie did it so perfectly because it shows Else not painting it as accurately, not accurately, but as detailed as what she saw, because when she was painting underwater, it was more to get a sense of the color palette. So I love that one.

And then the creepy fish one, it’s just… They’re just in there with these, you know, great names that are so just perfect. I love what they called them then, like “the great gulper eel” or “the saber-toothed viperfish.” I mean, I can just see kids, especially my son when he was a little boy; I read every night for a long time from a strange sea creature book until the book was falling apart. And I didn’t find it all that interesting, but he loved it. So, I dedicated the book to my two sons and our adventures. And when my son saw this page, he thought, “This is great,” because it’s a different type of art, too. It’s not the pretty type. It’s more scientific but kind of exciting.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. I’m so glad that’s the page you just finished off saying that you love because that’s my favorite spread. I just love that it’s this double-page spread. It’s the deep blue ocean and the texture that Melodie has given to the ocean. It has movement and then all the different animals on them. She’s made them with the bioluminescence sort of glowing around it, but it’s so subtle and magical. And then I love the little cursive scientific names next to each fish. And then, as you just said, there’s the list, clearly very easy to read, of these really cool names. So I loved that spread, too.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Oh, that’s great to hear.

Bianca Schulze

All right, so I have to ask you then since we said favorite illustration, are there any particular lines or text in the story that you feel most proud of or that you’d even be willing to read aloud?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I guess so. My wonderful editor, Amy Novesky, had the idea once she saw the beginning of my book, which I’ll read a little bit:

“The first time Else B. climbed down the long metal ladder dangling off the boat into the ocean by Bermuda, her hands trembled. It was 1930, and few had ventured deep into the sea before. Else, who loved to paint the natural world, had only dreamed of such an adventure. She felt a frisson of fear.”

And I love that my editor, Amy, let me keep “frisson,” because obviously, it’s a word children won’t know, but hopefully, they will learn it. And then they’ll be using it all over the place. And it’s always nice to be able to complete the loop of a story. And on the last page, this was Amy’s idea to ask Melodie to… Well, I guess first I wrote it, but to have Else climbing, ascending, into the boat to leave Bermuda. So we descend, she descends, and then ascends. And the last paragraph is:

“All because Else B. dared to take those first steps down the ladder and into the deep, dark sea.”

And I just… When I saw her… See, this is another amazing illustration. I can’t pick. The idea that Melodie has New York City, because that’s where Else went back to, behind her with the stars glimmering, and then two children reading National Geographic and the fish diving into it and they’re experiencing the world, all because Else B. dared to do the adventure and paint these wonderful paintings.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. And the publisher’s book summary describes this story as poetic, and I feel like what you just picked demonstrates why the word “poetic” is a great way to describe your writing for this story.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Thank you so much.

Bianca Schulze

You’re welcome. Well, let’s see. Okay, so, of course, I loved the back matter, and you’ve touched on the back matter. It has your author’s note, which I feel really gives a lot of… I mean, you did such a great job of such a concise little author’s note, but it provides so much more context as to why the story is powerful. And it just sort of demonstrates why it’s a great women’s history story. It’s empowering.

There’s also the scientific information that you mentioned. So another large word that kids might not know is “fathoms” and what a fathom is. And so you’ve described… I’m not even going to try and explain it right now, but fathom, want to know what a fathom is? That’s in the back matter. And then, of course, I love that you have your list of selected sources. So, talk to me about the kind of research that you did for this book. And I know you’ve touched on it a little bit, but then also how you decided what to actually put in the back matter.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Oh, great question. So, I always seek primary sources for my picture book biographies. Sometimes, I will pick a topic and find I can’t find enough about that person, and so I need to set it aside. And for this one, I was so lucky because Else Bostelmann herself is not famous and does not have a lot of information about her, but she did write some articles about her adventure herself. And the amazing research librarians at the Library of Congress helped me find those articles, which were in the Christian Science Monitor and Country Life. And these are back in the 1930s, 1939. And they found them.

And with her words, I was able to create so much of the depth of the story. William Beebe has written a great deal and talks about her. So that could verify some of the facts. And then I was inspired to write the book because I read an article, as I mentioned, that was written by Dr. Edith Widder, who’s an amazing oceanographer who has done TED Talks about bioluminescence, which are fascinating. And so Else was a tough one to find enough details about. But I think we nailed it as far as… with the help of these amazing research librarians.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, well, I feel like that’s a great side tab right now and not even necessarily a side tab, but I think there are probably people listening that would love to know how you go about contacting librarians and getting their help and how to tap into that. And then also, I lived in Washington, DC for quite a few years, and I am so mad at myself that I have never visited the Library of Congress, and I don’t know why. Well, because you live there.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Whenever we live somewhere, we don’t go to what’s right there. The Library of Congress is amazing. I actually got to do a talk there, a reading for my Maya Lin book, and it’s so… And I got a Library of Congress card and everything. I love my library cards. And I think as far as the Library of Congress, for researching, as you said, anyone, all of you should just type in a question into the website and you’ll get back these amazing responses. If it’s not the right department, they’ll send it to another department and they’ll send back, you know, suggestions and maybe ask you questions of “Do you want more about this?” or “Do you want more about that?” It’s just an incredible resource right at our fingertips. And so you don’t even need to go to the Library of Congress for that.

Bianca Schulze

That’s incredible. I actually did not know that. So, thank you for sharing that. I think that’s such a helpful tip. And, yeah, I mean, we just need to support our libraries and show up, too. We need them, and they need us to show up for them, too.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Yeah, especially during these times. Librarians are superstars for what they have to endure right now.

Bianca Schulze

Yes, absolutely. All right. Well, what do you think was the most unexpected fact or piece of information that you came across when you were doing your research?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Hmm. I thought it was fun. Of course, I couldn’t… Didn’t put it in there that these scientists would give parties on the island. You know, they were just… I think the whole… I guess it shouldn’t be a surprise, but it was such a fun thing to envision them all celebrating when they made discoveries. And it was so dangerous, this bathysphere they used. And when you read William Beebe’s accounts of it, the whole thing could have just blown up. There was sometimes water coming into it.

So I think that sense of living an adventure, and for Else, I don’t think she was quite the partier they were, but I think from one little blurb I read, she thoroughly enjoyed it. It was just such a different world for her than what she had experienced being part of a scientific expedition.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. So neat. Well, is there a question that you wish I had asked you about Else B. In the Sea that I haven’t asked you yet?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Hmm. Maybe…

What do I think children, as far as reading this book, would want to do with the ocean? I mean, how does it impact their view of the ocean? And I guess it’s that… This was the end of my author’s note: “I hope that Else’s story inspires us to care for and protect our marvelous oceans and creatures.”

So much of it is still unknown, and there’s really so much to protect there. And the scientist, Edith Widder, said she believes people need to learn about how magnificent the ocean and the creatures are to want to protect them. So, I’m hoping this is a type of book that will lead our children to want to be environmentalists and care for the ocean. And there are a lot of scientists who, actually, I’ve read about, who saw Else Bostelmann’s illustrations in National Geographic and were inspired to become oceanographers. So, I would love it if there would be some future oceanographers out there. Environmentalists.

Bianca Schulze

That’s really cool. I know, because it’s so easy even to just… If you… I know not everybody has the opportunity to go to an ocean or has been to the ocean, but anybody who has been to the ocean, when you walk down there, it’s so easy to just look out at the horizon and just be like, “Oh, this is so peaceful.” Which it is, but sometimes I think it’s so good to stop and think about more than that, like, stop and notice what’s beneath the ripples, what’s going on down there. Yeah. So, I think this book is something that does that. It really opens up your eyes to what is beneath the ocean. And there’s so much crazy stuff down there.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

I love that. That’s so well said. Right. We do. You’re right. I never… We always talk about the sunset over the ocean, but there’s… I mean, there’s a whole world underneath, obviously, some vast space.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. What do you hope that young readers will take away beyond just what you said? So I think that was incredible, to learn to be stewards of the ocean and to dive deeper into what’s beneath there and possibly even inspire young artists. Is there anything else you want them to take away?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Pay attention to what interests you, what the passions are. Because I do believe with all of us, things that we’re interested in as children burble up into our lives later. And if people pay attention to that, then that might be an interest that they follow. And I do believe everyone is creative in whatever way, not only just in the writing and art and music and dance but just creative ways of looking at the world and being an inventor, an explorer, a thinker. So I’d love for them to know every person is creative. I do believe that.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah. I love that. All right, well, I understand that you have another book coming, which is The Glass Pyramid. I think it comes out in 2025 and it explores, and I don’t have a French accent, so sorry. It explores the Louvre Museum and architect I.M. Pei. And I have to say I live near Boulder, Colorado, and I.M. Pei did the… Yeah, I’m going to say it wrong. The National Center for Atmospheric Research. There you go. We call it NCAR. So, I had to think about what the acronym stood for. So, anyway, can you give us a sneak peek into this book?

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Sharon, I’m so envious you live near that. I’m trying to see as many I.M. Pei buildings as I can, but I remember visiting the pyramid, the glass pyramid, and just thinking it was the most miraculous building. He had such a great sense of design. And I love modern art and modern design, but it complements the historic museum facade so nicely. And so it’s being published by Atheneum, Simon and Schuster, and illustrated by Xing Li, who has just gorgeous illustrations. I’ve seen sketches so far, nothing in color, but the detail of her line drawings and then the swirling… I can imagine they would be great colors, given her other books.

And Christie Choi is editing, and she’s always so… You know, someone said that to edit is divine. And I think it’s true because they can just give you just a little nudge or that tiny bit of an idea, like “How about maybe changing the order?” or something like that, that brings the magic to the whole process. But anyway, the book is about I.M. Pei’s challenges, because he was a Chinese American, not French, and the idea that anyone was going to touch anything involving the Louvre was not acceptable to the French. But he persevered. A lot of it was his upbringing, with his being very calm and patient.

And it’s just… I think it will inspire children to, when you have an idea, sometimes you have to be willing to persist and withstand a lot of criticism. And now, of course, they love it, and everyone in the world loves it, so thank goodness he didn’t back down.

Bianca Schulze

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I love France. I have this dream of living in the south of France someday, and I love Paris. And so I just… I can’t wait for this book. You know, I’ve been to the Louvre museum, and again, I’m not going to say it right, so you can all, like, tsk at me, but I’ve been to the Louvre museum, and I can’t wait to go back. I can’t wait to read your book. I want to tie it back to Else B. In the Sea real quick, because you just said something to me where, you know, with I.M. Pei being sort of calm, and I guess I got this real mindful feeling.

And so I think when people think of the ocean and the deepness of it, it can feel really overwhelming. And I love the ocean. I grew up by the ocean. I swim in the ocean, but I also have this fear, and so I like to snorkel. But the idea of diving like Else B. completely freaks me out, and I’ve decided that it’s because I have a busy brain, and I think when you go down under the ocean, it’s almost like the world stops, and you have to become part of what is existing down there, and everything about you disappears. And I find that really overwhelming.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Yeah, so you’re so right, though. The first time I snorkeled, I was amazed that it was so quiet all of a sudden, that all the sounds of everyone out in the water and the boat nearby, it just was quiet. And there is an eerie eeriness to that. I mean, it’s a beauty, but it’s just like meditation is challenging to me. Because I do… I, too, have a busy mind, which is why I need to do something like dancing to be in the moment. And, yes, you’re absolutely right.

Bianca Schulze

Can you imagine 1930s Else B. down in the deep ocean with this giant, like, copper helmet on? I mean, the peace and the level of mindfulness that she must have had was like… It must have been top-notch.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Absolutely. And she… Yes. I don’t even know if she’d… I couldn’t find ever that she had even visited a beach before that, and she was just so focused on, “I will learn what is under the ocean so that I can paint it and convey to William Beebe what colors we’re seeing when we talk about it.” Yeah. Amazing.

Bianca Schulze

So cool. Well, Jeanne, thank you so much for coming on the show today to share Else B. In the Sea, The Woman Who Painted the Wonders of the Deep. I know that it’s going to create curiosity about what’s beneath the surface of the water, and hopefully it will inspire so many kids to want to care for and protect our amazing oceans and creatures. So, thank you so much for writing another beautiful biography.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Oh, thank you so much, Bianca, for inviting me, and I loved our discussion. You always ask such great questions and send me thinking of connections I’ve never even thought about. So thank you so much. And your podcast is amazing. Here’s to The Children’s Book Review. I really appreciate all you do.

Bianca Schulze

Thank you so much, Jeanne.

Jeanne Walker Harvey

Take care.

Show Notes

Thank you for listening to the Growing Readers Podcast episode Art, Science, and the Sea: Jeanne Walker Harvey On Else Bostelmann’s Extraordinary Life. For the latest episodes from The Growing Readers Podcast, Subscribe or Follow Now.